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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
:help:

Ok, so a little background.. I have a 2006 Troy Bilt Horse – 50” 3 blade deck & 23hp Kohler Courage engine. The 1st issue I had was my battery going flat.. I deduced that the relay had failed (no clicking on/off when power supplied). The original pin configuration mini-relay (5-pin 20/35A) was impossible to find.. ended up getting same relay, but 10/20A. This appears to be doing the job – battery appears to be charging – but I wonder if the lower amperage is causing/contributing to my current issue...

PTO problem – After replacing relay and charging battery, mower worked as it should – for about 30 mins only.. then PTO (cutting deck) simply stopped. Thinking the battery wasn't fully charged, I recharged overnight and tried again the next day.. mower worked as it should for about 10 mins before PTO stopped again. Now thinking something more serious. Next two days PTO would not engage at all with engine running at usual mid/high RPM, but would come on occasionally at very low/idle RPM only. With PTO engaged (deck cutting) at idle speed, increasing RPM by any amount stops the PTO/deck.

I have seen youtube links regarding PTO Clutch adjustment fixing intermittent PTO operation (vid shows 3 x bolts on external clutch housing).. however, this mowers PTO Clutch appears to have no adjustment – certainly has no bolts to tighten. Also, it’s a relatively ‘new’ mower.. maybe only 150 hours use – I wouldn't have thought the clutch would have worn out after so few hours.

Lastly, and for the record, this mower hardly ever starts under its own charge (even before this PTO problem) – pretty much always requires a jump-start.. but once it was going, it use to go just fine. I know the PTO requires a minimum voltage to engage.. (battery is about 13V when off.. and mowers LCD says its 11.8V while motor running – which I think should be enough for PTO use).. but I do wonder it that’s anything to do with current PTO issue...

Anyone..?
Anyone..?
:^:
 

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Hello, your issue is lack of voltage for the machine and the electric PTO. The machine should have 12.8-14.0v when running with proper battery charge and stator output. Sounds like you have a failed stator or voltage regulator.
Here is the service manual.
http://www.kohlerengines.com/onlinecatalog/pdf/32_690_01_EN.pdf

Go to page 43 and start there. They show you how to find and fix your issue. Hope this helps!
 
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:ditto:

Battery voltage is way to low. If your voltage is less running than it is just sitting then all you are doing is running off the battery and not charging it back up.
 
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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
Thanks for this information.. been fully through the Troy Bilt Manual - never consider the Kohler one! Guess what I'm doing my next days off?! :/
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
Thanks for this information.. been fully through the Troy Bilt Manual - never consider the Kohler one! Guess what I'm doing my next days off?! :/
SO.. back from the garage.. I charged battery again overnight - resulted in 30 mins cutting before PTO stopped again. Parked it up (this time not charging battery), tried again next morning.. no PTO. Battery is around 13V at rest (motor not running) - and around 15V with mower running high RPM (voltage tested at battery terminals).

Referring page 44 - Electrical System - Step 1/ Tested voltage from Rectifier-regulator B+ to ground (high RPM) = above 13.8V (approx 17V I think). Added load (2 x headlights) - voltage from B+ to ground increased to approx. 20V (and blew both bulbs). Manuals 'Conclusion' implies "charging system is ok".

Steps 2, 3 & 4 require 'Stator' access.. looks like quite a job to get to it.. is it?

I went on to "Battery continuously charging at high rate".. With engine at high RPM voltage from B+ to ground = more than 14.7 volts (as per above testing, approx 17V without load). Manuals 'Conclusion' implies "Faulty rectifier-regulator; replace".

What do you think Guys? Does the Rectifier-regulator sound suspect? Is this likely to explain my intermittent PTO? Seems strange - been thinking the issue with my PTO was lack of voltage - but manual says "more than 14.7V = faulty rectifier". Is it an issue where the faulty rectifier isn't getting the charge to the battery? If so, should I even bother trying to access the Stater to test? Or simply look at replacing the rectifier? :dunno:

I'm relying upon you guys to know what I'm doing.. cause I sure as heck don't! :confused:
 

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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
I went on to "Battery continuously charging at high rate".. With engine at high RPM voltage from B+ to ground = more than 14.7 volts (as per above testing, approx 17V without load). Manuals 'Conclusion' implies "Faulty rectifier-regulator; replace".

What do you think Guys? Does the Rectifier-regulator sound suspect? Is this likely to explain my intermittent PTO? Seems strange - been thinking the issue with my PTO was lack of voltage - but manual says "more than 14.7V = faulty rectifier". Is it an issue where the faulty rectifier isn't getting the charge to the battery? If so, should I even bother trying to access the Stater to test? Or simply look at replacing the rectifier? :dunno:

I'm relying upon you guys to know what I'm doing.. cause I sure as heck don't! :confused:
further - just done a diode test on rectifier.. 1 x AC terminal reads '1'; the other reads close '001' (both versus B+ terminal).. From what I've seen, both AC terminals should read same (or very similar) value.. sounds like thats my issue.. anyone want to comment, or confirm?? appreciated..
 

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I'd like to go back to something else you said, "this mower hardly ever starts under its own charge".

What does it do when it's not starting on it's own ?? Does it just click or does it spin to slow to start or ??
 

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Discussion Starter · #8 ·
I'd like to go back to something else you said, "this mower hardly ever starts under its own charge".

What does it do when it's not starting on it's own ?? Does it just click or does it spin to slow to start or ??
Hi.. currently, when I turn the key, theres just a single 'click' from the starter.. like there is not enough power to turn starter motor over.. when I've charged battery overnight, turning key results in 'click-click-click- etc.' - starter motor attempting to turn motor over, but not. Since this issue, have always needed to jump-start from car. Battery is less than 1 year old.. and shows reasonable voltage (13V at rest / 15V running).
Even before this PTO issue (on this or previous battery) I'd need to jump-start it initially.. but after its has been running for a while (say 30mins) it will then restart by its own battery.. ironic - about the time the PTO cuts out these days! :banghead:

Thinking I'll go to mower/bike shop - have them check if battery is ok, and if they have a rectifier-regulator tester.. much easier than taking the whole mower in :(
what do you think?
 

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When it won't start try jumping from the solenoid battery terminal (cable going to battery +) to the small wire. If the starter kicks in solidly and you can do this a couple times then you need to use a relay. It's a common problem on the 80's JDs.
I did it to both mine and it does work. It's due to the safeties in the circuit. You don't bypass any of them but you use their signal to give the solenoid more amps through the use of a relay.

In the diagram below the green wire is what gets cut and the relay is added.
It's not that difficult and after having a sometimes starting JD for over two years it's never faltered since the install.
I bought the relay and it's connector on Ebay. Any four or five contact 25-40 amp relay will work. Same as they use for a headlight or fog light install. It's not really carrying much current it's just able to give it straight to the solenoid without all the safeties and their contacts. But again, all the safeties still are working.

Now, back to thinking about the PTO :idea:

 

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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
When it won't start try jumping from the solenoid battery terminal (cable going to battery +) to the small wire. If the starter kicks in solidly and you can do this a couple times then you need to use a relay. It's a common problem on the 80's JDs.
I did it to both mine and it does work. It's due to the safeties in the circuit. You don't bypass any of them but you use their signal to give the solenoid more amps through the use of a relay......

Now, back to thinking about the PTO :idea:
Thanks for help Guys..
but I've just about given up.
Completely and utterly over it..

now deciding between shipping it off to a doctor - and taking out a 2nd mortgage to pay for it
or getting 50 concrete trucks in - and be done with grass forever

end.
 
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